IHADAV8.com - Turbo Buick Tech, and Nonsense
Tech Area => General Buick Tech => Topic started by: poppy1440 on February 21 2015, 06:18:10 PM
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Hello, I guess I got tired of the car running well so I decided to fix a front seal leak I've had for a while.
I put everything back together and now it just spins over.
I did not prime the oil pump. I contacted Mr. Earlbrown and he feels that I should be ok not priming because of the quality of his build on the front cover. I've had this cover for a while and I am very pleased.
I think that maybe I have installed the cam sensor 180 out although I really don't see how I could have because when I removed the cam sensor I set it a 25 after TOD and I used a permanent marker and made marks so it would go back in the exact way and I put a pair of vise grips on the flywheel to keep it from moving. I also used the cam sensor alignment tool that plugs in with the light on it. I plugged it in before I removed the cam sensor and the light came on. The light also came back on after I re-installed it which makes me believe that it went right back in the same way.
I've triple checked all the connections.
I've checked and it does have gas.
I've checked the fuel is prim
I just wanted to see if ya'll had any ideas b4 I pull the cam sensor again.
Question #1 Even if the pump isn't primed shouldn't the car start.
Question #2 Even if the cam sensor is 180 out shouldn't the car start but run like crap.
Thanks in advance
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Check the crank sensor
Reset the cam sensor
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Have you pulled a plug to see if it is wet and check the thing for spark?
How is your oil switch? I know mine needed some coercion to get it connected up.
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thanks i'll check these things and get back to ya'll
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If the plug is wet we are getting fuel. Then with a helper you can see if it is throwing spark. That'll give some direction to where/what to look at next.
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Are you running a TR6 ignition? If you are, car will not start if the cam sensor is not set correctly. Ask me how I know... It's easy to set with the TR6, just have to pull the coil pack, change the dip switches and watch the tach
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I checked the crank sensor and it is aligned perfect and plugged in.
I went through a few of the steps on vortexbuick no start trouble shooter and it appears that I need to pull the cam sensor back out and make sure its installed correctly. To start with.
I just don't see how I put it in wrong. I took the proper steps to make sure unless the cam could have turned although I have the flywheel secured so it couldn't turn. I must be 180 off
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I checked the spark plugs and the are getting wet
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But do you have spark? Pull a plug, put the wire back on it. Lay it on the valve cover and crank the engine over...do you have spark jumping the plug gap?
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b4 I pull the cam sensor I am going to follow the crank sensor install procedure on vortexbuick.
I wasn't aware that there was a procedure to install crank sensor when I installed it. I just put it on and made sure the slots would travel through without hitting it and torqued it down.
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The crank sensor was out of adjustment. It was touching on one side but it still won't start.
I pulled a spark plug and placed it back in the spark plugged wire and placed it per your instructions and I am not getting spark.
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i'm of course not sure but if the crank sensor and the part on the balancer made contact, i would be inclined to think you "may" have damaged the crank sensor. you might pull it off for an inspection. post some pix, if need be.
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It was barely touching on the back side.
I'm wondering if it's possible to adjust without the tool the site speaks of.
There is not enough room on either side to slip a credit card in between but it is not touching on either side on any of the reluctor blades now.
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I used a matchbook on the last one I did. Make sure to turn the engine a full revolution to make sure none of the "tangs" hit the sensor. I'm not positive but I think I would put a meter on the pigtail to see the sensor short or open when the tang goes by the sensor while turning the engine over by hand. Others might have a better idea for testing it.
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Do y'all I should focus more on the crank sensor rather than pulling the cam sensor.
Will the car still crank if the sensor was installed 180 out
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Do you have the cam sensor setting tool or a meter and directions on how to set the cam sensor?
http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm (http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm)
How are you coming along on setting the crank sensor?
http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cranksensor.htm (http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cranksensor.htm)
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cut a section out of a one liter coke bottle and use it to check the clearance on the crank sensor.
Theory says it should be the ignition module but I don't know why in this case. But, check the CCCI fuse and the ecm-ign fuse in the fuse block to make sure something did not cause one of them to pop.
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Yes I have a cam sensor tool and the light does come on.
I think I may have it installed 180 out because I didn't pull a plug and make sure it was on the compression stroke. I was pretty sure it was installed correctly because I had everything marked.
No I do not have a crank sensor tool.
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I'll check the fuses and attempt to reset the crank sensor.
Hello Mr. Steve.
I hope this one isn't going to be as bad as the last issue you helped me with.
But if it does, I'm sure I'll learn something in the process.
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you don't need a crank sensor tool..a gap of about 0.025" is about right but the plastic out of a one or two liter pop bottle is about right.
If you have injector pulse (blinking noid light), then both the crank and cam sensors should be working...even if the cam sensor is not adjusted properly.
We are assuming you have injector pulse because you said the plugs were wet. I would prefer to use the noid light, but.....
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Theo...these cars are just like the women in our lives
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Mr. Steve, I think I just wanted to have another reason to bug you and pick your brain for knowledge.
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Setting the cam sensor only takes ten minutes. I'm fortunate I'm one of these people that doesn't think too much. :)
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You also might want to check the engine cam sensor female prong's are not push back or corroded.
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ok I checked a few more things.
1. I reset the cam sensor. I made sure it was at 25 atdc and then used the cam sensor tool to reset it.
2. I used a playing card and cut it long ways about a 1/4 inch wide and placed it on each side of re-luctor wheel inside the crank
sensor. The reluctor wheel goes freely thru the sensor with very little if any contact.
3. I checked all the fuses.
4. The fuel pump is priming to 40psi.
5. Key on I have over 11 volts on the green wire that goes to crank sensor. unplugged
One thing I did not mention is that I just got my ecm back from eric at turbo tweak who made some repairs to my power logger.
I thought I would throw that in because I stated earlier that the only thing I had done was change front seal.
But he assured me that all is well with the ecm and chip.
Next I plan to text the crank sensor itself.
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Did you plug back together the Orange ECM wire ar the battery? It won't start if that's unplugged
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Yes, I checked the ecm wire...
but it is acting just like if it were not connected.
tomorrow I am going to check all connections and the crank sensor adjustment again if I get a chance.
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Maybe the sensor got damaged so kind of way when I removed or re-installed it.
I'm going to check vortex buick tomorrow to see if their is a way to check the sensor itself.
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I'm was betting on the cam sensor or crank sensor cuz those are the two most likely items that could have got screwed up with the repair you did.
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again, if the car has injector pulse, it would seem that the crank sensor is working...
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When you put the cam sensor in, Then the cap back on then hook up the cam sensor tool did you turn the cap towards the passenger fender un till the light goes out then turn it back just untill the light comes back on?
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I didn't say you didn't need to prime it.. I said you didn't have to take it apart and pack it with Vaseline. Since you've been cranking on it, does the oil light go out (assuming it still works KOEO)?
Also, on your crank sensor, do you have the relucter ring in the correct slot?
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Sorry for mis quoting you Mr. Brown.
I have it in the slot closest to the reluctor wheel and farthest from the plug.
I'll check to see if the oil light goes off when I get off.
I also bought a noid light today, so I'll check the injectors also
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I checked and oil light does not come on.
one thing also the check enginge light doesn't come on when the key is first turned on.
I used the noid light and it does flash when attempting to crank.
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Does it have an oil light, or did you install a gauge in that spot? If you have a gauge, does it show pressure when cranking? I would probably disconnect the outlet line to the oil coooler and pour oil back down it into the oil pump.
The crank sensor appears good to me.
The car will not start if the check engine light is not coming on. The light gets its power straight from the battery...does not go thru a fuse. Do you have a spare ecm to swap into the car?
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Yes, the car does have an aftermarket oil pressure guage and it does not show any pressure on the guage when attempting to crank.
I followed the no start trouble shooting guide on your site and followed the instruction for no check engine light. The ecm fuse is good and I have voltage on ckt 339 & 440.
I thouroughly checked the wires in the harness and swapped out ecm and also swapped another tt chip version 5.6.
What can I be over looking?
Are you speaking of the line that goes into the turbo from the T on the oil pump.
I wonder why the check engine light is not coming on.
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ok I checked a few more things.
1. I reset the cam sensor. I made sure it was at 25 atdc and then used the cam sensor tool to reset it.
2. I used a playing card and cut it long ways about a 1/4 inch wide and placed it on each side of re-luctor wheel inside the crank
sensor. The reluctor wheel goes freely thru the sensor with very little if any contact.
3. I checked all the fuses.
4. The fuel pump is priming to 40psi.
5. Key on I have over 11 volts on the green wire that goes to crank sensor. unplugged
One thing I did not mention is that I just got my ecm back from eric at turbo tweak who made some repairs to my power logger.
I thought I would throw that in because I stated earlier that the only thing I had done was change front seal.
But he assured me that all is well with the ecm and chip.
Next I plan to text the crank sensor itself.
After reading your problem all over again it seems you mention that got your ecm back from eric at turbo tweak who made some repairs to the power logger.
maybe you can look and see if the chip is secure onto the chip socket, or like Steve mention replace the ECM with another since it seems you have done almost everything.
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I tried another ecm and chip
I'm going to check the bulb in the dash tomorrow to make sure the SES bulb isn't blown because when following the no start trouble shooter I am going the route when the light doesn't come on. If the bulb is blown I am taking the wrong route on the trouble shooter.
Question, Can I assume the crank sensor is adjusted properly since the Noid Light came on while trying to crank.
I am still not getting spark but the injectors are pulsing.
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Did you check both fuses? The ecm-ign fuse and the ccci fuse? Both have to be good.
If you ground the A5 wire at the ecm, the check engine light should come on. Grounding that wire completes the circuit thru the bulb if the key is ON. If you changed the computers, it would seem that the problem is in the bulb or the bulb socket....neve r tried to start one without a working bulb so I don't know what happens.
I have said several times that I see no evidence of the crank sensor being bad because you cannot get an injector pulse if the crank sensor is not working. Having said that, I can only give that 99% certainty because I have seem some strange things on these cars that do not compute.
If there is no spark, but you have injector pulse, then it should be the ignition module....but it could also be a connection to the module so I would remove the plug to the module and check the pins to be sure one is not pushed back. I kinda doubt that because the module seems to be getting the signal from the crank sensor as it is allowing the injectors to be pulsed.
So that brings up the question if you have a different ignition module/coil that you could swap on to see what happens.
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OH, and I would not try to start it until the oil pump is primed.
There are two hoses that come out of the oil cooler adapter that is behind the oil filter. One brings oil from the pump to the oil cooler built into the radiator and the other hose brings oil back from the cooler in the radiator back to the adaptor where it goes onward into the engine. If you unscrew the hose going out of the adapter to the radiator cooler and the radiator end, you can pour oil down this hose and it will go back into the oil pump cavity and prime the pump...when the hose won't take any more oil, reconnect it to the radiator.
If you took the adaptor off at some point, the only sure way I know to prime the pump is to pack it with vaseline. these pumps are too far from the oil in the pan and don't like to prime themselves when the engine starts
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I did the same oil primer thing as Steve mention with the following:
First and most important disconnect the orange wire behind the battery, and you must have an oil pressure gauge in order to make sure you do built up oil pressure before you reconnect the orange wire for start up.
I didn't pack the oil pump with Vaseline as most do
I first filled the oil filter as much as I can and then put 3 quarts oil in oil pan , then I remove the lower oil cooler from the radiator taped it against some pipe so the oil cooler hose is in the vertical position. Then place a small funnel inside the oil cooler hose, you will need a Chevy oil pump prime tool and place it inside the Cam Sensor hole; make sure the tool slot is fitted on the oil pump shaft. DO NOT start the engine, if your oil pressure gauge is electric then just turn the key to the "ON POSITION”, and have someone inside the car telling you that you have oil pressure. Attach the cordless drill machine to prime tool and run it at CCW position, at the same time fill the oil cooler hose with about 1-1/2 quarts of motor oil, or until you have oil pressure present. Once you have oil pressure, re-install the oil cooler hose back onto the radiator; set the cordless drill machine to CW until the other person inside the car tells you that you oil pressure on the gauge. Remove prime tool rotate crank shaft to new marking of 25* after TDC install the Cam Sensor as per Casper's Instruction. Don't forget to connect the orange wire behind the battery
http://www.casperselectronics.com/store2/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=653 (http://www.casperselectronics.com/store2/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=653)
And it you don't have a Casper Cam Sensor Tool then you use this read up.
http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm (http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm)
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If you didnt have an oil pressure gauge, couldnt you pin out the oil pressure switch with a DVM to check open vs. ground while you prime the pump?
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You don't have to have a gauge when priming an engine with a drill motor. You can't miss the 'hit' when the pump gets loaded.
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good point!
around 6:30 you can hear the 1/2" drive electric impact in this video working pretty hard to run the pump.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1I_9854y_o&list=UUmtNb4VMnSXVbauJ4Dfn96w (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1I_9854y_o&list=UUmtNb4VMnSXVbauJ4Dfn96w)
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i could not find the oil lines that you mentioned.
Mine has a Tee and one line goes to the oil pressure guage inside car. One goes to the turbo and one goes to the engine block. I couldn't find any lines going to the radiator from this area.
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second picture down shows the adapter with the in and out connections. This is what the filter screws onto. http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/frontcover.htm (http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/frontcover.htm) Third picture down shows in and out.
Sounds like it has been removed by a prior owner.
You can fill the filter with oil and reinstall it. Then remove the cam sensor and rig a tool, if you don't have a primer, and spin the pump drive with a drill and see if you can convince it to prime. I have forgotten which way the pump needs to be turned...seems like it is counter clockwise but Earl or someone can tell you for sure...or maybe they did in one of the posts above.
You need to get some oil pressure before you crank on it anymore cause trying to start it dry is not a good idea
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Update,
I will prime the pump b4 I move forward.
My ignition and coil modules and crank sensors all have lifetime warranties to I exchanged them out today just to eliminate some variables.
I am also going to see whats going on with dash lights.
I also got a new set of plugs because mine are soaking wet with gas and appear to be filed out.
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glad you got the new plugs...More than once, I have seen plugs that have no fire be that way because they were wet and carrying the spark down the insulator instead of across the gap.
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I would not replace the module/ coil if it worked fine before you change the seal. The more parts you change the more possible problems you introduce to your no-start condition. Back up and go over what you disturbed during your R&R of the seal. Leave on all parts that worked BEFORE your started tearing it apart. I would go back and start from scratch and set the timing THEN setup the cam sensor.
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ULYCYC you are 100% correct I didn't think about that but I have already exchanged the parts yesterday. I just have to hope I got good parts.
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If you had no spark because the plugs were wet, you will have spares!
BTW, check the ecm-sol fuse also
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glad you got the new plugs...More than once, I have seen plugs that have no fire be that way because they were wet and carrying the spark down the insulator instead of across the gap.
When I was young and dumb, I would do road calls. I used to pull the plugs, torch and heat the gas off, throw em back in and usually the car would start right up. If the plugs were hard to get to I would try for 3/4's of em anyway.
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Update
I pulled the plugs and they were filed out terribly and were full of gas.
Replaced coil pack and module.
Removed crank sensor to install new sensor and noticed that there is damage present on old sensor. Apparently it was damaged when I put it back on originally. I kept trying to adjust it but I didn't remove it to inspect it.
Primed oil pump. It took a lot more time than I thought it would take. I had to run the cordless drill approx. 5-8 minutes before it would prime. But when It did prime I could really tell the difference in the sound of drill. Then I used a regular screw driver and turned by hand just to check and it doesn't just free wheel it has pressure on it.
I have a two questions
1. I have a after market oil pressure gauge and I had someone watch the gauge and it never showed oil pressure or moved while spinning the drill even when primed.
I didn't have the key on or anything because I have my gas lines off to get to the bolt that holds the cam sensor down.
The copper line is connected to the oil pump and to the gauge. Shouldn't this gauge show oil pressure or at least move when primed even though the key is off because the only wire that is connected to it is for the back light.
2. Although I'm running aftermarket gauge can I still connect the factory oil pressure switch so the dash light will come on in case of a problem with the oil pressure. It still has a place to connect the original but I don't think it wasn't connected previously.
Tomorrow I plan to make sure I get cylinder #1 on the compression stroke then go to 25atdc, install the cam sensor, set it with my caspers cam sensor tool following the instructions.
Properly install the crank sensor and use plastic from coke bottle to adjust it.
spin engine over a few times with the sparks plugs out to dry out cylinders. Re-install plugs & wires, Reconnect my orange ecm wire and I feel very confident the car will start.
Just for information. Did ya'll know that these cars will run and run well with the coil wires installed backwards. I'm glad you asked how I no this. what I mean by this is when I went to remove my ignition the 1-5-3 was pointing towards the front of the car and the 2-6-4 was towards the firewall. And apparently it has been like this far approx. 3 years with absolutely no issues.
My theory is It ran like this because of the way the coil was wired to the module. It was wired backwards also. Lol
I started not to tell ya'll about this because I know ya'll are saying this guy is kinda crazy but oh well I learn something every time I tear something up. I am just grateful for you guys being here to help people like myself. Thank ya'll so muck.
I'm acting like the car is already running. lol
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If the gauge did not show oil pressure, it ain't primed!
On the coil....one coil pack is cylinders 1 and 4. It does not matter if 4 is connected to 1 and 1 is connected to 4 on the plugs. They both fire at the same time so it does not matter if the coil is on backwards, or not...assuming the module was connected properly. I have seen this quite a few times.
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If your gauge has a physical oil hose ran to it, it will show pressure no matter what. If it's an electrical gauge with only wires running to it, the gauge has to be powered up.
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It sure felt like it was primed.
The drill loaded up was clicking because i had the torque set on it to make sure i didn't break the tooth on cam gear.
Plus I used a screwdriver to check and it definitely has tension on the shaft now.
but I will go back and keep turning it until I get the guage to move if you think that's what a should do
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definitely...i f it does not show pressure on the gauge, oil is not circulating
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definitely...i f it does not show pressure on the gauge, oil is not circulating
I know it sounds like a repeat, but can you describe to us your step by step of your procedure of priming the oil pump
It doesn't sound right since you are claiming you feel the cordless drill had some back pressure, yet there is nothing showing on the oil pressure gauge. Do you know for sure that oil pressure gauge is working?
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Lock the clutch on the drill and turn the pump
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keep turning it until I get the guage to move if you think that's what a should do
I'd like to second or third the go and turn that drill until it makes pressure. You might need a larger drill to make it work. I like my Milwaukee hole shooter. It has plenty of power for this and mixing tile adhesive and grout.
With out the prime the engine could run without oil and then you will be in for a lot of extras work not to mention the money.
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Getting ready to go drilling for oil and I'm not gonna stop til my helper says the guage is moving its moving.
Thanks
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good luck!
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Update.
My helper from yesterday must have been blind because as soon as I started turning the drill my son said it's moving dad, and I did verify the gauge had oil pressure.
Verified cylinder #1 was on compression stroke, went 25atdc installed and plugged in cam sensor following instructions on cam sensor setting tool and tightened cam sensor hold down bolt.
Installed and plugged in new crank sensor in proper slot and confirmed that there is at least a plastic bottle thickness on both sides of sensor on all of the relucter wheels.
Set plugs to a tight 35 gap and installed plugs and plug wires.
Installed new coil and module confirming that they were connected properly. checked all of the connections to the module and all of the pins and connectors look good.
Confirmed that firing order is correct. Triple checked. lol
Fixed loose connection to the bulb in dash and it comes on now when the key is turned forward.
Check connections at the ecm.
Confirmed I have fuel pressure at the fuel pressure gauge.
Confirmed injector pulse using noid light.
Triple checked my spark plugs and confirmed the coil is wired
Confirmed plugs or firing by removing plugs and having someone turn ignition and fire is jumping across tip of plugs.
Went and got five more gallons of gas just incase gauge was off.
Re-connected the orange ecm wire at the battery
Car Will Not start. pulled new plugs and they are extremely wet.
is there a plug that I may have left off that I can't see.
gonna walk away and go take family out for dinner.
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Witch way are the cam sensor wires pointing? Can you take pics of this. Can you describe how you put the cam sensor in and time it thank's.
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Trust me, I know how frustrated it is to do all the work you did and still no engine start. :013:
Now that you enjoy your diner and claim down, is there anyway of you having another ECM since reading back on
« Reply #24 on: February 22 2015, 10:10:27 PM », you claimed you got your back from Eric at turbo tweak who made some repairs to my power logger.
Is there anyway of disconnecting and/or remove the power logger board to see if that might be the problem. From what you have written of replacing just about everything the only thing might be the ECM itself.
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Take the cap of the cam sensor and make sure the ring under the cap is spinning when you crank the car over.
when you put it back together, loosen the hold down a bit so you can twist it while someone else cranks the car over. Might dry the plugs off before trying to crank it over again.
I'm running out of stuff, the thing is getting fuel, it seems to be sparking maybe just not at the right time. Compression but it was running before. I'm beginning to think something might be wrong with the ecu if it was changed after the engine ran.
Let us know.
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I tried another ecm that I have and assumed it was good but maybe not.
the procedure I used for installing the cam sensor was to place my finger over cylinder#1 and have someone bump the ignition. When I felt pressure on my finger I told him to stop.
I then put a socket on the crank bolt and moved the piston back to the top of hole using a flashlight to verify.
At this point the slot on my harmonic balancer was right at zero On the little plastic guage mounted to the block. I them turned the crank til the mark on balancer was at 25. I turned the drive on the cam shaft to a position so that when I installed the cam sensor the dot on the bottom of the sensor would be facing the passenger side of the car. After I installed the sensor I turned it clockwise until the light came on on my tool then I turned clockwise til it just came on.
I snuggled the sensor down and confirmed the light was still on. Removed the sensor tool and plugged in the sensor.
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Is the window cut out in the bowl under the cam sensor cap facing the drivers side corner marker light when you put back in to time it ?
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Theo, if it had spark when the new plug was laid on the valve cover, and the noid light was blinking, then everything is working...but the question is now why is it flooding?
Be sure that you install the cam sensor exactly like I say to here http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm (http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/cam_sensor.htm)
It is very important that number one is on top dead center of the compression stroke...you will know it is coming up on the compression stroke because it will blow a big puff of air out of the number one spark plug hole if you remove then plug...when it comes up on compression stroke for tdc. If it does not, you are on the exhaust stroke.
Strange that it is flooding even if you are not on the compression stroke, tho.
That kinda sounds like a bad ecm. You can try swapping it again.
Also, dry the plugs off, disconnect the fuel pump, and with the plugs all back in, then squirt a spray of engine starter, gasoline, or even carb cleaner into the throttle body and see if it fires and tries to run when you crank it over.
Also be sure the maf is connected.
I am not sure what is going on but it sounds like it is pumping fuel into the engine like mad because it should try to fire even with the cam sensor in backwards.....
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Ok, thanks and yes the mass air is connected.
At least it's firing now, remember it wasn't at first.
Im leaning towards the ecm also. strange that both are doing the exact same thing.
I also checked all of the fuses again also.
probably something simple like I have something unplugged but I dont know what because I have fire and fuel and injector pulse.
Just a little info on the ecm that was sent to eric.
the Orange wire was loose in the harness and when I attempted to make it secure I damaged the corresponding pin on the ecm so I removed that pin from a spare ecm and soldered it in and the car ran without any issues.
The reason I sent it Eric was because I couldn't get the power logger to work after my repairs.
Eric informed me that the power logger was shot. He is an awesome vendor btw.
He went far and beyond what I expected him to do in helping me.
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the odds should be against it being the ecm if both ecms do the same thing.
It was running before you pulled the cover, correct??
All plugs look wet with fuel, correct?
Set the cam sensor as I lay out in the link above....be sure it is on the compression stroke. It will blow air out the plug hole and both the intake and exhaust valves will be closed as it comes up on TDC. Be sure you are measuring 1.45" Counter-clockwise from the timing mark on the balancer.
Dry the plugs, spin the motor over with the plugs out, and then reinstall the plugs. disconnect the fuel pump and see if it fires when you spray some kinda fuel into the throttle body and crank it.
If it does, try unplugging the maf, connect the fuel pump, and try to restart. this would give you a limp home mode and it should start even tho it would be rich.
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Ok, thanks and yes the mass air is connected.
At least it's firing now, remember it wasn't at first.
Im leaning towards the ecm also. strange that both are doing the exact same thing.
I also checked all of the fuses again also.
probably something simple like I have something unplugged but I dont know what because I have fire and fuel and injector pulse.
Just a little info on the ecm that was sent to eric.
the Orange wire was loose in the harness and when I attempted to make it secure I damaged the corresponding pin on the ecm so I removed that pin from a spare ecm and soldered it in and the car ran without any issues.
The reason I sent it Eric was because I couldn't get the power logger to work after my repairs.
Eric informed me that the power logger was shot. He is an awesome vendor btw.
He went far and beyond what I expected him to do in helping me.
So what you are saying is now that you repaired the ecm the engine started and running, or do you still have an issue?
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No. The car is not starting now.
The engine ran fine after my repair the power logger just didn't work. I just sent both to Eric.
I just decided to fix a leaking front seal while I was waiting for the Ecm and powerlogger to get back.
Mr. Steve, looking at the instructions on your site. Looking back the only thing I didn't do was to measure the 1.45" exactly.
I made a vertical mark perpendicular to the slot on the balancer so I could see it once it went under the plastic dial. And that is how I got my 25 atdc. The dial stops at 22 I think so I went what I thought would be 3 more degrees.
I will go back and mark the 1.45" exactly.
I use to have a little piece of paper that came with the tool but I can't find it but I'll go back and make sure it's exact.
And I will also follow the other instructions you gave me.
Thanks
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Cut a piece of tape 1.45 inches and stick it to the left of the cut on the balancer. Do the 278CIKILLER trick and shave down a cork and lightly press it into the number 1 spark plug hole. Bring the balancer around until the cork flys out...you'll know you're coming up on the compression stroke. :) Bring the balancer around till the left edge of the tape is at zero. Drop the cam sensor in.
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Scooby,
Facing the engine Shouldn't I put the right side of the tape on zero instead of the left side.
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If your looking at the front of the motor going from 0 to the left of the mark,
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There's a 'cut' in the balancer...whi ch is the timing mark. The timing tape goes on the left side. When you roll the engine clockwise from zero to the end of the tape...then you've gone 25 degrees after top dead centre.
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I grind and painted a white groove left side, like the original groove on the right side of the balancer
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Great pic! That's what I should do.
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Scooby,
Facing the engine Shouldn't I put the right side of the tape on zero instead of the left side.
Yes, that would be counterclockwi se
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That's how mines done too works good!
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Great pic! That's what I should do.
Thanks, I forgot to mention while I had the Balancer off during the timing chain replacement, I clean, Painted black the did the white timing groove color, and finally spray painted a clear coat over everything.
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Thank you Jesus.
Its running.
You guys are awesome.
I was iming the cam at 25b4 Tdc instead of 25 aftc.
I did check cylinder#1 to make sure I was on compression and it was.
once I reset the cam sensor correctly the car fired right Up.
I really appreciate all the time you guys spent to me with issue.
THIS was a great leaning experience.
Look forward to hearing from me shortly with something else.
Thanks again Mr. Steve. And everyone who helped.
Thanks Keith who called and kept me encouraged.
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Hallelujah! :)
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Glad you got it :rock:
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Thanks for the heads up, and enjoy your ride :rock:
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whoo hoooo!
:rock:
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Glad it's back running again...someti mes it is the simplest things that drive us the most crazy! :D
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I bet we will never have to tell him to go 1.45 AFTER top dead center again, :cheers:
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With all the problems he has encountered trying to get it to run right in the past, I suspect he is one of the best troubleshooter s around!
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it is how I learned, with the help of you guys
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learning is a never ending ordeal
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I'm leaning more and more each time I have an issue with this car.
but believe it or not its therapeutic to me.
I doubt I have put 1,000 miles on my car in the last 5 years because my life is so hectic. When I do get a break I spend it with the family. but now both of my sons have part time jobs and they are hardly ever home and my wife is addicted to television so I go out to my shop and take something apart and 9 times out of 10 it doesn't work properly when I put it back together and thats when the fun begins.
Mr Steve if they think this was tough they should take a look at this thread. http://www.ihadav8.com/forum/index.php?topic=3164.msg49568#msg49568 (http://www.ihadav8.com/forum/index.php?topic=3164.msg49568#msg49568)
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Yep, you firmly implanted the need to check for egr leaks in that thread!
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Just for information the car is still leaking and it seems to be coming from front seal area again. I think Im just gonna live it.
Question:
what should oil pressure be at idle and 45 mph cruising.
Mine is 20 and 38-40
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Its really around 15 @ idle
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Not to insult you, but are you sure it's oil? or is it water?
What type of front seal did you used?
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Neoprene seal.
I'm not insulted but im 100% sure it's the oil pressure guage.
The car runs great but it just seems a little low
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Clean the living shit out of the front of the engine with brake parts cleaner.
Go around the block then throw some baby powder where you think it's leaking. Whatever is wet will light up like the forth of July.
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When "throwing" baby power I use an old oil field water hauler trick. I have an empty mustard squeeze bottle with the twist to open top. I use a funnel to pour the baby power into the mustard bottle(I must be cleaned out and dry).
Then you can "squirt" the baby powder where you want it.
http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/10/10/1007_bestselling_condiments/image/08_frenchs.jpg (http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/10/10/1007_bestselling_condiments/image/08_frenchs.jpg)(http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/10/10/1007_bestselling_condiments/image/08_frenchs.jpg)
(http://dearbornbrand.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/72Dpi-Sample-for-web.png)(http://www.schmidtlaw.com/wp-content/uploads/baby-powder-lawsuit1.jpg)
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSes3oMs5fIjqv3VXuZKIy56CWBhrOIH8AmUHx2j7scO0ynwcphaA)
I usually cut the top off the baby powder as it takes too long to get it out other wise.
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Thanks
I'll give that a try.
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Pit some pipe dope on the threads before screwing the fitting in
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Did you reinstall the oil slinger in front of the bottom timing chain gear?
And is this a GM timing cover? And are both the locating dowel pins still in the block?
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I don't recall installing anything other than the gasket.
It's one of your covers Mr. Brown.
Im gonna try to see what the oil slinger looks like.
It looks like the oil is gathering right below the front seal on the little beveled lip.
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Did miss the hidden bolt on the cover?
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I just pulled a picture of the oil Salinger.
I didn't remove it nor did I see it.
I wonder if it was put on when the motor was rebuilt a couple of years ago.
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I've ready posts saying that not having one can cause front seal leaks.
Caveat: I have no first hand experience with that and I've always had the slinger in place.
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definitely allows oil to be thrown straight against the seal/crank interface
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seal/hub :D
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I just pulled a picture of the oil Salinger.
I didn't remove it nor did I see it.
I wonder if it was put on when the motor was rebuilt a couple of years ago.
Was the oil leak there when the motor was rebuilt?
It might be possible to remove the side plate on the timing cover to see if you do have the Slinger in place
As you can see where the Slinger is located, and if you can't see it or feel it's there, then you might have to remove the timing cover, and Balancer in order to replace the Slinger back home.
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Not this salinger:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8c/JD_Salinger.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8c/JD_Salinger.jpg)
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When I think back, I feel you might be right about the oil slinger probably wasn't put back on when my engine was rebuilt a few years back because it has been leaking for as long as I can remember