IHADAV8.com - Turbo Buick Tech, and Nonsense
Tech Area => General Buick Tech => Topic started by: Shimy87 on June 12 2014, 09:51:40 PM
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Seeing that I need to replace my turbo, I was going to go with a 5931 from full throttle but started to think about it. With my current set up is there any advantage to going with a bigger turbo? Or is that a waste of money. I dont want to get a bigger turbo and then need to upgrade several other components to make it work well. Advice please!!!
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For a bigger turbo...then you'd have to upgrade everything else. Throw the 5931 on it...and call it a day.
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Like he said. . With the tires you run, you don't have enough traction anyway
Steve
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Thanks guys. Kinda figured so but had to ask :cheers:
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ordered up the 5931 this morning :rock: sent a message to Eric about my TT chip to see if it would need to be redone because of this turbo change or if I could just tune with chip I have installed?
Will I see much, if any, performance gain with this turbo??
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If your turbo was a stock one...then it should pull quite a bit better on top end
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ordered up the 5931 this morning :rock: sent a message to Eric about my TT chip to see if it would need to be redone because of this turbo change or if I could just tune with chip I have installed?
Will I see much, if any, performance gain with this turbo??
You have version 5.6 alky chip...which doesn't have aggressive mode. His 5.7 alky chip does...do some reading up on it. From what I've seen...you'll need more 3rd gear fuel.
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Sending my chip in to be set up for new turbo :rock:
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Sending my chip in to be set up for new turbo :rock:
Perfect! Now off to the track to beat on my junk!
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ordered up the 5931 this morning :rock: sent a message to Eric about my TT chip to see if it would need to be redone because of this turbo change or if I could just tune with chip I have installed?
Will I see much, if any, performance gain with this turbo??
You have version 5.6 alky chip...which doesn't have aggressive mode. His 5.7 alky chip does...do some reading up on it. From what I've seen...you'll need more 3rd gear fuel.
Stands to reason. More air in requires more fuel to put with it. Good call on the updated chip.
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Sending my chip in to be set up for new turbo :rock:
Perfect! Now off to the track to beat on my junk!
I prefer to beat my junk in the shower :rofl: couldnt resist
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Lol!!! Thats hilarious. keep us posted about the turbo
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Got old one off last night, just waiting for delivery now. :rock:
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I noticed you went a notch up from the 44/49 turbos...looks to be closer to the old 60 series. Wondering if you have enuf converter?
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Told the guy at full throttle it wasnt stock, didnt know exactly what I had but it must be very close to stock, and he thought this one would work well?
Can you tell me what to expect if its a good combination or more importantly what to expect if it isnt? Probably a stupid question but I dont know what I have and the shop that did it ( tranny rebuild with new coverter) didnt give me any numbers for it. I'm assuming it has something to do with a stall RPM but I'm clueless about how to determine that???
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Start the car, foot firmly on the brake, put the car in Drive and start mashing down on the gas while firmly braking...look at the rpm on your scanmaster-when the rear wheels start trying to turn even though you have your foot on the brake, that rpm point will be close to your practical stall speed. If your rear brakes are not adjusted properly, or, are worn out, this will obviously lower the rpm point where the rear tires start turning....
the stock converter would start to move the tires around 2000-2100 rpm. This will work fairly well with a 44 or 49 if it is tuned well but may be a tad slow when it comes to the build up of boost.
Ideally, my experience is that a stall around 2600 is about perfect for a 44 or 49. Some people run even more but they usually smoke the tires a lot more than is conducive to acceleration.
I am guessing that 2800-3000 rpm will work better with the turbo you ordered.
If your stall rpm is lower the car will be slow off the line until the boost comes up but it will probably be fine from a roll as the rpm will be high enuf to allow the turbo to spool.
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I will have to check it out when I get it back together. I know its not close to 2000 but not as high as 3000. Probably on the lower side, 25 ish, but that may help my traction problem with these tires? I dont have super high expectations, would just like to get in the mid 12's.
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May Have traction problems as the speed comes up in low. May be able to take some power out with the chip in low. Should be much faster than mid 12s. Learning to drive it will help
Steve
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Journal bearing...or double ball bearing?
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No idea. Its the one full throttle sells, the 5931
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journal
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I'd want about 2600...but the off the shelf convertors are usually bout 2800. It'll spool like a mad whore. Drag radials are gonna be a must.
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UPS just delivered the goods!!!! Gotta pick up some new nuts and bolts and then cant wait to here her whistle!!!
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i had a TE-6031 W/a Precision exhaust housing and hated it, the lag was for ever and a day.
Once i went with the Garret turbine housing it got a lot better but still very laggy
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Dont know much about turbos but I guess I'll soon find out. Its what I got so I'll have to live with it if its laggy
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Got the turbo on...worse part was hooking up the frickin oil feed line, had a hell of a time getting that threaded in. Also had to clock it to line up the outlet with the intercooler. Now gotta modify the turbo cover to get it back on. Then road test!!
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Oil line leaks, and now alky system is all f.. up. The light that tells you its primed and then turns green, flickers unles you on the gas, then it stops. When first started it idles like shit....I think the alky is spraying just a bit. Shut it off at the store and when I came out the only way I got it started was to unplug the alky pump and held it to the floor.....bare ly started before the battery was done. What the hell is up, I didnt touch any of the alky system???? :013
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Turning the alky knob to off...should shut it off. Takes a little bit of driving for the ECM and chip to jive with one another. Follow Erics instructions to the letter.
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Turned the knob to shut off alky system. Fixed oil line leak. Test drove car and runs fine. Turn alky back on. Light flickers red and it does spray just a little in the motor. Cant understand what happened, didnt touch anything on the system except the up pipe the hose is in???? Checked all connections and they all seem fine. Any help would be appreciated. I have an e-mail in to Juilo but doubt ill hear anything til next week.
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You are probably stuck with Julio unless Paul knows the fix
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Juilo got back to me right away this morning with some things to check. I had a couple questions and again got right back to me. GREAT customer service!!!
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Thats awesome!!!
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Lets just hope what he told me will fix it, will see tonight. Also turbopowered68, in the little driving I have done, very laggy :icon_confused:
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yada yada...
I am guessing that 2800-3000 rpm will work better with the turbo you ordered.
If your stall rpm is lower the car will be slow off the line until the boost comes up but it will probably be fine from a roll as the rpm will be high enuf to allow the turbo to spool.
like I said.....nothi ng to do with the turbo. It's your combo.
When you get the alky fixed, set it to come on about 12 psi. Take fuel out of first gear until your O2s read about 730-740 unless you see timing retard at that level. You might also try adding another degree or two of timing in low.
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I didnt know I could adjust when the alky came on. I was thinking after I got the alky system sorted out I would try adjusting the fuel and timing in first to see if I could liven it up a bit. Hard to really tell on driveability right now with it screwed up.
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Just to add to what Steve said. Erics 5.7 alky chip has aggressive mode...which brings the low gear timing in instantly. All you have to do is bring the low gear timing off the 128 default...to 129. The car should hit harder in low gear. In regards to alky...what I use to do was keep bringing the alky turn on point later and later...till I saw a touch of KR...and then bring it back one notch till it went away.
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Looks like a bad map sensor is causing my alky troubles. Can I get a map sensor at an auto parts store? After I replace the map how do I adjust when the alky starts spraying?
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Julios default settings in the PAC controller are fairly close...if you have the combination correct. I wouldn't mess with the settings until you've verified what your stall speed is. Steve left you some instructions on how to do that. If your convertor is too "tight" for your turbo...then it doesn't matter how much tuning you do...it's gonna be a slug.
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Lets just hope what he told me will fix it, will see tonight. Also turbopowered68, in the little driving I have done, very laggy :icon_confused:
The least expensive change you can make is a Garrett OE exhaust housing. And if you are still unhappy the next change would be a converter. Thats the order that i went with and i don't regret it.
I went with a L/U with an advertised stall of 2800 that feels more like a 2400. I would follow whatever these guys suggest for a converter choice.
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Looks like a bad map sensor is causing my alky troubles. Can I get a map sensor at an auto parts store? After I replace the map how do I adjust when the alky starts spraying?
You need a three bar map sensor and I would be sure the one I bought was made by Delco. If you cannot get one locally, I am sure Mike, or another vendor, will have one.
The idea of putting the alky turn on around 12 is to keep it from cooling down the exhaust stream until the turbo is well into its spool...on a turbo that does not want to spool easily from a standstill, turning on the alky closer to zero boost will kill the spool up for awhile.
I don't have one of Julio's kits so I am hesitant to tell you how to adjust it. It may be that you cannot adjust the actual turn on point but instead you adjust how much it is spraying when it does turn on. He has an "Initial" setting in the controller and it may adjust how much it is flowing initially rather than the turn on point...hopefu lly one of the guys that is experienced with the kit can clarify.
First, get it working and follow Brad's instructions on your new chip with regard to the "aggressive" setting. With your tires, you cannot take much boost anyway at low speed.
The 5931 is close to the old TE60 best I can tell so it needs more turbo and I doubt any of us would have suggested it with your converter but it may work out anyway with some tweaking...I suspect once you drive the car and get it up to about 3000 rpm in second gear, it will spool fast when you step on it....but I guess we shall see as they say
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Brad, what is this "aggressive mode"? I don't see any mention of it in the 5.7 instructions or on the forum :)
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Brad, what is this "aggressive mode"? I don't see any mention of it in the 5.7 instructions or on the forum :)
He explains it in addendum...sli de down to the bottom.
http://www.turbotweak.com/turbotweakinstructions57.pdf (http://www.turbotweak.com/turbotweakinstructions57.pdf)
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To simplify things...turbo s love heat to spool...and that's why Steve is telling you to pull low gear fuel. Leaner air/fuel is hotter...makin g it spool quicker...and more low gear timing will give 'er more punch off the line. What I recommend...is going to the track where it's safe...and making a balls out run with everything on default settings. I'm betting PL is gonna show your low gear fueling around 850 for 02's...pig rich.
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all I have is the SM for tuning. For as much track time as my car see's I cant justify spending the money for PL. Once i get the alky fixed I can start tuning and see what happens. I might be able to get it working "good enough" as i'm not trying to shave every tenth off I can.
I do appreciate all the help you guys have given me :cheers:
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all I have is the SM for tuning. For as much track time as my car see's I cant justify spending the money for PL. Once i get the alky fixed I can start tuning and see what happens. I might be able to get it working "good enough" as i'm not trying to shave every tenth off I can.
I do appreciate all the help you guys have given me :cheers:
The PL is worth every dime.
Make a pass look back frame by frame sensor by sensor and then make adjustments.
The only thing i use the scanmaster for is idle settings and KR on the fly.
and malfunction codes
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Agreed. PL is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
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Brad, what is this "aggressive mode"? I don't see any mention of it in the 5.7 instructions or on the forum :)
He explains it in addendum...sli de down to the bottom.
http://www.turbotweak.com/turbotweakinstructions57.pdf (http://www.turbotweak.com/turbotweakinstructions57.pdf)
Add that to the things I learned today :)...I remember him saying something about it but I guess I never read to the last page....:D
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Consider what you spent on the turbo when you can't justify the PL.