IHADAV8.com - Turbo Buick Tech, and Nonsense
Tech Area => General Buick Tech => Topic started by: gusszgs on October 13 2015, 07:45:11 PM
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Hey guys, made it down to TMP for a test & tune yesterday. Haven't been to the track since 09-10. Wanted to find out how this transmission I built would hold up. Happy to report the trans shifted beautiful with no issues what so ever. Almost looks like I know what I'm doing. :icon_lol:
Anyway on to the results. I got 5 passes in and was somewhat disappointed at the start. 1st pass I only ran a 13.39 @ 101. 60 ft was a brutal 2.06 This was with the TT chip set on default. 18 psi alky set at 6 MT DR's at 27 psi. Could not hold boost and pushed through the beam, so I'm sure I lost some et there.
2nd pass I made no changes, but lowered the Mickeys down to 22psi. Still only 0-1 psi at line and went slower. 13.43 @104 with a 2.21 60 ft :rolleyes; Not sure where the better mph came from.
3rd pass was about the same . Little better 13.21 @105 crap 2.13 60 ft again.
4th pass I decided to forget about building boost at the line.....brake s just won't hold. Went into chip and pulled 10% fuel from 1st gear and added 2* timing in 3rd. Results were better as the car ran 12.7 @109 2.07 60 ft.
5th pass I figured I'd get a little more aggressive with the boost, so I turned it up to 22-23 psi and added some more timing 27/26* and pulled another 5% fuel from 1st (thought that may help the 60). Side note I got 0 kr on all runs which was nice
This pass I ran 12.38 @ 113 with a still crap 2.05 60ft. When the car left I could feel it unload the hides about 30-40 ft out
At that point I called it a day as it was getting late. I did see Rich (Bird) down there down there, man his car is something!
So here is my combo:
Motor is completely stock except for the addition of Comp 980 valve springs.
Turbo is a TE60, Precision .63 Ex housing. RJC 3" DP.
TT "ALKY" chip with 60 lb injectors. Mark Jackson stock stretch IC. LT-1 MAF/Translator
Suspension is all factory stock with an air bag in the right. 255/60 Mickey ET Streets
Trans is fresh 2004r with Husek 9.5 3021 LU
I think if I can can get the 60ft down to something respectable I can break into the 11's. I was going to try the 'ol jam the e-brake on at the line but chickened out. Was kinda disappointed I couldn't build more boost at the line with this new converter but really can't get it to hold past 1psi.
Any thoughts on these times? Oh, also the car is full weight Ltd.......prob ably close to 4000 lbs with me jammed in it
Jim
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Jim...if you go out again this year let me know. I'll bring my PL and laptop and dial the whore in. :rock:
What were the high gear 02's at the traps?
You're MPH is increasing turning up the wick...so you're making more HP and not 'blowing through' the convertor.
That's an S2 under the hood of Rich's car.
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That is awesome. Any outing that you can drive the car home from is a successful outing to me.
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Thanks Brad
I was talking to Rich for a bit, very nice guy. Watched one of his passes. car went 10.40's 15 psi pump gas :O
To be honest Brad I didn't look at the O2'S every pass, but did a recall on the last pass and it locked a 789 at 105 mph
I really need some more seat time and runs. Used to old NA muscle cars like my GS. There's so much shit to monitor and seems I forget one or two things each run. The bonus was no KR on any of the runs.
Also forgot to mention I did jam the e-brake on in the pits and it held 7-8 psi. I just turned into a suck at the line.
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That is awesome. Any outing that you can drive the car home from is a successful outing to me.
Rich I trailered it down :) Track is 100 miles from house and wasn't sure about the new trans
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I thought you didn't have a trailer. That's ok, it didn't break so it is still a very successful outing. A couple more trips like that and you'll be hitting 11s more often than not.
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Line lock is pretty much mandatory with these little engines...they make lots of torque. Keeping the rear brakes cool is where it's at. Erics low gear fueling is notoriously rich. With the full 20 percent pulled on mine they were still at 820. That reminds me. I should send that race chip back to Eric for a reburn for low/high gear fueling...whil e my GN is in for paint.
That 60 turbo...turns into Godzilla at 25 plus PSI.
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I don't recall I'd you told us what brakes your running. Double bump for the line lock to keep the rear brakes cool during burn out. I had my best 60 foot with the ET streets at 15 psi cold. They would heat up during the run and be sitting at 17 psi after the run. I took rich's advise and did some burn outs at the house to check the patch to get the pressure just right for a solid patch on both tires. Glad the tranny is holding up! Good luck!
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Aluminum rear drums...all long pads...S-10 wheel cylinders...br aided brake lines...Powers lot rotors with HPS pads...line lock.
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The weather can make a difference in what pressure you need to run in the tires. A solid patch is a good indicator. But the 60' number is what gets you down the track.
I am disappointed that the car could only hold a 1psi launch. I know a good 60' would have it in the 11s.
Have you taken your car to the track Jason? I know it is wanting to but with the cooler weather it should really lay down a good number.
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Aluminum rear drums...all long pads...S-10 wheel cylinders...br aided brake lines...Powers lot rotors with HPS pads...line lock.
I would think he could hold a lot more boost with that rear brake setup...
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The 16930 in my car will 'flash' to 4 grand with that setup without breaking a sweat.
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Have you taken your car to the track Jason? I know it is wanting to but with the cooler weather it should really lay down a good number.
Nope. Last time I was at the track was at the Texas Nats. Been picking up odds and ends that I'm going to need for when the barn motor is completed. Also need to get the barn tranny over to Jakes. Theses days my kids activities and home projects have the priority and will be that way for a few more years.
The fella that bought my old white t, took it down to Houston at royal purple raceway and blew a head gasket or both, I don't know. He did bust off a 7.1something in the 1/8th before he blew it. Also, he had a cage installed so he added some weight and the 6262 are the only changes from when I sold it to him. His wife called me asking if I would repair while he was at drill sergeant school, I politely declined
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We put bigger turbos on these cars to make HP. If you're going to leave them at 22 PSI...don't expect much to happen. The 60 series turbos wake up at 25 PSI on up.
Tuning is easy. Keep the high gear 02's at 780 with each jump in boost pressure. Add fuel/alky as necessary. Low gear 02's I set at 780 at the 1-2 and 2-3 shift points...and add a couple degrees of low gear timing. Remember...tur bos love heat. Lean low gear fuel out...and add a little low gear timing...and watch what happens.
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Thanks guys,
The brake set-up is stock fresh rotors/pads on front. flex hoses are Russell braided (all 3)
Drums are cast with soft shoes adjusted tight with S-10 wheel cylinders. System bled properly. Yes I do have line lock.
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I thought you didn't have a trailer. That's ok, it didn't break so it is still a very successful outing. A couple more trips like that and you'll be hitting 11s more often than not.
I don't own a trailer....... .a good friend was kind enough to lend me his.
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Thanks guys,
The brake set-up is stock fresh rotors/pads on front. flex hoses are Russell braided (all 3)
Drums are cast with soft shoes adjusted tight with S-10 wheel cylinders. System bled properly. Yes I do have line lock.
You should be able to hold a shitload of RPM's on the line. I'd be curious what the convertor is doing on the line...and what it's flashing to. Another situation where PL is invaluable.
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UPDATE
Spent a good part of 2 days addressing my brake holding issues. Adjusted, adjusted,adjusted. bled bled bled.......wit h the proportioning valve depressed. By late Sat afternoon I was holding 5-7 psi in driveway and over 10 with the e-brake as well.
So, off to the track again today in my snow suit to see if I could improve on last week. Got there, and thought it was closed. For the 1st 45 minutes I was the only tard there. They took my money so I was racing. About 10-12 cars only showed for the day.
Anyway,
1st pass no ticket, I think the kid hadn't turned the printer on :rolleyes;
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2nd pass 12.10 @ 113 1.94 60 24psi
3rd pass 12.56 @113 2.30 60ft spinning (-20% fuel out 1st gear)
4th pass abort (blew DR's off, got back in and blew em off again about 330 mark)
5th pass 12.6 @112 again spinning out of the gate 2.16 60ft
6th pass 12.6@ 112.5 2.30 60 ft leaving at a gentle 0-1 psi and spinning
7th pass 12.46 @ 113 but crappy 60 again 2.17 Mickeys lowered to 15psi from 20
Track was cold I know as the temps were no more than 45* with a nasty head wind. Got a tinkle of KR on 1 pass of .9 at 44mph when I bumped the timing in 1st 26*
I had the tire pressure all over the place to try and help hook but no luck. The 1.94 was at 20 psi tires are MT DR'S 255/60
*NOTE there was delays waiting for the plows to clear the ice n snow :icon_lol:
Yes Brad.......... ...PL and slics are on the list :)
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Jim, I'm likely gonna be at Cayuga next Sunday. I have 9" slicks on GN rims...and also 10.5's on GN rims. You're welcome to try both. I can promise you ya' won't spin 'em. :)
I have a spare ECM sitting here...and I can nip it open to accept PL. PL is in my car...and I can't get to it...but I'm sure Dan Keller will lend me his...and I'll use my laptop.
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Oh I'm sure I wouldn't............a nd I appreciate the offer Brad but next weekend is out for me. I've a 25th wedding anniversary party to attend for my best bud. I have a set of Hoosiers QT's I use on the GS but they're 11.5 x 27"......I doubt they'd fit, but man they hook.
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Jim...any idea what your RPM's were at the traps? Stock cam in that engine? Steve...do you think with that convertor unlocked...and the 26" tire...that the stock cam was out of breath before he hit the traps? If so...will the 28" slick pull the RPM's down in a more useable range? Just thinking out loud here. :)
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By the way what slick fits nice in these cars without any rubbing worries? Will a 28 x 10" fit in there ok on a 8" steel rim? Offset needs to be 3.5? correct.
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I had a look at the 27x11.5 Quick Time Pros. They come in with a section width of 11.3. The 9" MT's come in at 10.8...and the 10.5S comes in at 12.5. Jim...double check that I got the Quick Time sidewall measurement correct. If they're 11.3...then they'll fit on an 8" rim with a 4" backspace and aluminum drums...or a thin spacer with cast drums.
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Here's what fits...and please take note. I run aluminum drums...which are a tad thicker. If you have cast drums...you'll have to adjust with shims.
GN rim 3 and 7/8th" BS
MT 28x9 slick...no shim
MT 28x10.5S and 10.5C...no shim
MT 275/60/15 DR...no shim
Billet Specialties 4.5" BS
MT 28x9 slick...7/32" shim
MT 275/60/15 DR...7/32" shim
The MT 275/60/15 DR shares the same sidewall measurement as the MT 28x9 slick.
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Thanks for the tire info Brad.
The car was pulling hard all the way to the end.........fe lt really good. Yes, stock factory cam still 110k on unopened block.Just a set of Comp 980's
Sorry I don't have the rpm's at the traps. Oh, also I testED out the converter after getting the brakes sorted out. At 0 psi SM read 2750. Went to 2950 at 2 psi. about where Dave said it should stall with my set-up
I did try leaving at 5 psi on one of the runs and felt like I was at the ACC racing the Zamboni
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Sounds like David got the stall correct. :) The cigarette lighter bouncing off the back window is an indication of a good launch. :) I always know if I've done a 1.7 launch or better...as it knocks the wind out of me. A 1.7 launch is 1G on the body.
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I think you are on the right track. Just cold today and it doesn't sound like they did any track prep. And with a head wind I think your mph looks good. Just have to get her to launch and hook. It'll be in the 11s fo sho!
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How long of a burnout were you doing? I learned from Gary Schatz that you really have to stay in the burnout a few seconds longer than what you think is good to really get the MT's sticky. Then again track temp and prep makes a difference too.
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Sounds like David got the stall correct. :) The cigarette lighter bouncing off the back window is an indication of a good launch. :) I always know if I've done a 1.7 launch or better...as it knocks the wind out of me. A 1.7 launch is 1G on the body.
It's startling the first time it happens and puts a big grin on your face
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Jim...any idea what your RPM's were at the traps? Stock cam in that engine? Steve...do you think with that convertor unlocked...and the 26" tire...that the stock cam was out of breath before he hit the traps? If so...will the 28" slick pull the RPM's down in a more useable range? Just thinking out loud here. :)
As we don't have a trap rpm to look at, or a log to see how the rpm ramp is looking near the traps, it's hard to say. My gut feeling says a taller tire will leave harder and ramp the boost better off the line and it will make more mph without any slow down.
Looks to me as if he should have plenty for a taller tire.
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How long of a burnout were you doing? I learned from Gary Schatz that you really have to stay in the burnout a few seconds longer than what you think is good to really get the MT's sticky. Then again track temp and prep makes a difference too.
Jason, the last two weeks I've tried every duration of burnout one could try, especially yesterday. Loooong, medium, just a haze then pull ahead. Nothing worked........ ..ya temps and track prep were garbage. I mean there were only about 10 cars or so. And only running 1 lane.
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Jim...any idea what your RPM's were at the traps? Stock cam in that engine? Steve...do you think with that convertor unlocked...and the 26" tire...that the stock cam was out of breath before he hit the traps? If so...will the 28" slick pull the RPM's down in a more useable range? Just thinking out loud here. :)
As we don't have a trap rpm to look at, or a log to see how the rpm ramp is looking near the traps, it's hard to say. My gut feeling says a taller tire will leave harder and ramp the boost better off the line and it will make more mph without any slow down.
Looks to me as if he should have plenty for a taller tire.
Steve I totally agree, I'd like to go to 28" slick.I think the 255/60 Mickey is 27".
I'm not too handy with computers and that's why I've hesitated on the PL. But I'll get one. If I can build my own trans I should be able to remove the ECM
Wilst were talking about the PL............ .I have a Acer Aspire One notebook that was my daughters and it just sits and collects dust now. Would this little guy work for data logging the PL? It has no provision for a cd. How do you load the PL on it?
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Download the drivers online
Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
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Jim...get your daughter to load the PL software onto a memory stick. It'll plug into the port on your laptop. FT has Bobs PL software on their support site...and Eric likely has it on his too. Or you can download it off those sites directly to your laptop if it is internet capable.
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Ok good I'll do that.
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Just an update on the PL
I downloaded the goodies for it off off Eric's link for windows 7 Looks like I was successful so far.
When I go into the file on my desktop for the PL it lists 6 different drivers.
4 are Adobe (install guide, PL input connections, manual 1.0.0, and SM update procedure)
The other 2 are Flash PL40 and PLC
My questions are, do these look to be correct? Anything missing here?
Also, I can open the Adobe ones fine but the Flash and PLC have a "pop up" window saying pub could not be verified.
Are you you sure you want to run this software?
Can I run it? I dont have the PL installed in the cars computer yet, was just wondering if I could see all the PLC distplay windows ect...
Sorry guys if these questions are no brainers, but I'm PC challenged. My daughters are no help cause they're Apple freaks now. I'm just an old fart who's used to dwell and timing :)
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You can run it and see the PL window on the computer. That's how it works. Once the PL window is open on the computer, you then connect to the car from the PL window by clicking on connect.
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Ok thank you Jason
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One of the drivers is Flash PL40
When I double click on that is has a black background and is asking "enter the com port number" wth is this and what number do I enter? Or does it even matter at this stage? Haven't installed the PL board in the car yet.
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It's been a long time since I installed my PL. I would recommend going to the full throttle tech support forum and reading through. You'll need to know the version of Windows that you're running. If I recall correctly, you may need to go and install some drivers manually but like I said, it's been a while.
http://www.fullthrottletech.com/forumdisplay.php?f=75 (http://www.fullthrottletech.com/forumdisplay.php?f=75)
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(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc101/gusszgs/7361e514.jpg) (http://s214.photobucket.com/user/gusszgs/media/7361e514.jpg.html)
Gave Geez a wash. Too much rubber from track stuck on him
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Nice!
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Love the paint scheme! Looks real nice!
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Thanks a lot guys!
I was really showing off to Rich that I figured out how to post a pic :icon_lol:
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Nice pic. Car looking great. Did you host somewhere?
I got my new phone up and going. Learning curve with this thing compared to android.
I'm glad you are learning power logger. You can teach me when I get one. Not really in the budget currently. Though I got the car to start. Two victories. Just have to find employment.
Trans still shifting? I know you will be in the 11s before spring time. Just have to get it to hook with some boost.
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It'll have to wait til spring now Rich.
I'm using photobucket.
Good you got the car going. Was it the relay?
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I'd say it wasn't the relay because it didn't start with either of the three I have and it has now started with one of them. I will have to try the other two out. I sat down to eat my supper and the daughter called. She was on her way back to school and was about half way and the headlights on her car stopped working. So I got the trailer hooked back up and headed down to pick her and the car up. He boy friend worked on them last night when I changed the oil m filter. I guess they need more work. We will take a look at them in a couple weeks for thanks giving.
Didn't get to try the Steve suggestions yet. Planning on a long jumper wire and dropping the tank for an inspection of the electrical connections. It will be reliable if it kills me.
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Went back to track Sat.........th at's me Brad's talking about with the 3021 Husek converter.
All seems well but 60' is still brutal. 2.0 was best. All parameters are good car went 1 mph slower than Oct of last year, but had more timing in it then and much cooler air. Was hot there Saturday. Wasn't looking to get a killer ET just improve 60' really.
Moved the MTDR tire pressure all over the place......no dif Went through log and was leaving at around 5psi.
Last pass car launched HARD for the first 30' or so (guessing) then blew em off bad! So I assume I'm squatting, car hooks and rebounds and unloads the tires. This is what it feels like anyway, was by myself so nobody watching. Car HAS 90/10 Lakewoods in the front (new) rear is stock with DS airbag @8psi. and UMI lowers.
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Jim is also running the stock rear swaybar. Any thots as to what he should run for an air pressure in the MT's and the rear air bag would be appreciated. He launched it at 8 PSI and 4 PSI...same 60' each time.
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Good shocks on the rear(bilstein, kyb?) I think the 90/10 fronts might be too much and with the stock springs even a 70/30 might over do it. I like the cheap Monroe or Gabriel for fronts. Plenty of give and they keep the front up to let it hook. Then settle down mid track to get the front down to lessen wind resistance. I know those drs will hook just have to make them. I was used to bias tires. Might need less pressure in the radials.
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And I thought picking up 21 mph in the second half wasn't enough but looking at this slip that picked up 23 mph in the second half, the 21 mph Jim's car picked up is looking good . There is an 11 second run in it, I know it.
(http://cdn.dragzine.com/image/2014/05/slips-fontana2.jpg)
Car 103
http://www.baselinesuspensions.com/info/Launching_A_Drag_Car.htm (http://www.baselinesuspensions.com/info/Launching_A_Drag_Car.htm)
Launching a drag car.
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I would lose the lakewoods at this point in time....
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MT ET streets at 15 psi, Bilstiens all around. Baseline suspensions upper control relocation brackets and their upper control arms, UMI non adjustable lowers with stock stabilizer bar. Car was lowered an inch all around with spring changes. 1.58 60' on foot brake and launching in the mid teens on boost.
If you like the cars stance, weigh it and then find the instant center. There is better room for adjustments from the uppers as long as you can get the lowers as horizontal as possible.
These cars are heavy up front. Good luck!
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Ya eh Steve, maybe I'll pull them Lakewoods off. Any suggestions on a replacement? It's the only change I made really. O2's are in the 780-800 range throughout. No WB yet
Thanks guys all for all input. What pissed me off is I ran a 12.1 with a 1.94 60' on a skating rink last fall.😊
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I think they are causing the car to unload.
I prefer just a regular shock like the Bilsteins for all around driving and enuf people have used them on the strip with success to know they work. A better solution might be the QA1 Stocker Stars that are adjustable. They cost more than the Bilsteins but they let you play with the front end rise. If using them, I would start with them set in the middle.
A cheap shock like Monroes will also work but they won't be worth a damn for street handling after a few months of driving.
Try a stiffer rear bar like the Helwig or an old ATR bar if you can find it...
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For the same reasons that Steve mentioned above, I'm about to test some bilsteins that are valved for a street stock racecar with a little more rebound than compression in the rear and vise versa in the front. Hoping I can report back soon with good results as its a much cheaper and simpler solution for a lot of folks.
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Mine works pretty good I use a helwig bar QA 1 single adjustable up front an cheap Monroe sensortrac in the rear. I soften it up front for track and dial up firm for handling on the street car handles pretty well for no front bar plus l have 2" drop spindles 1.69 on Nittos
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These subjects often bring a conflict between reality and theory.
The G body cars usually have an instant center that is in front of the car instead of being tucked back under the car so that more leverage is available to shift front end weight to the rear tires.
Theory says, in that case, that these cars should not be able to launch worth a darn, but reality shows that they can do a pretty good job.
What many tend to forget about launching is that it takes two things to get a low short time. First we have to have traction and second, we have to have enough power to use that traction but not overcome it. Until we reach that point, doing a lot to shift the instant center is not going to significantly help.
We have guys that have gone less than 1.4 in the short times on stock suspensions but they were in a totally different league from most of us when it comes to hp to the tires.
I think if you are the average ten second car that money is better spent on replacing bushings, stiffer lower bars, and a good rear sway bar along with a properly working limited slip or some version thereof.
30 spline axles are a good investment if you upgrade the limited slip. C clip eliminators are required most places but the ball bearing version are not long lived on the street due to their reduced load capabilities and they usually leak to boot. If you are serious, then have the ford rear housing ends installed-they hold the axles in by a bolt on collar.
For a ten second car, the Helwig bar, ATR clone, or such seems to be perfectly adequate altho the H&R bar is probably even better...not sure there is much benefit on a performance vs cost ratio.
Larry's Monroe shocks on the back and QA1's on the front is pretty idea as far as I am concerned. I have seen many a car pull 1.5's on Bilsteins all the way round so there is not too much benefit from following reality instead of theory in this case again, imo. Removing the front sway bar seems to help and the car should still be drivable assuming a larger rear bar.
Air bags? A passenger side bag may help altho there are plenty that pull good times without them. Get someone to stand behind the car while you quickly bring it up to launch boost. If the rear bumper is parallel to the ground, you are good to go. If the passenger side is closer to the ground than the drivers, an air bag can help. If all is working, you should get two equal length burn out stripes on launch.
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Well I can't put any blame on track prep Saturday fellas. Actually the guy was spraying just before I lined up to lights. Also some big dudes were pulling off 1.2's in the same lane.
I'll admit I'm a greenhorn when it comes to suspension. I have a GS that ran 1.64 60' and straight as an arrow. But, I do have Paul's H&R upper and lowers. Junk rear shocks and Comps in the front.
So, with this car obviously I'm dissapointed and I know running the number is a hell of a lot easier said than done.
Maybe the car would 60' a lot better with Pauls rear bar and some better rear shocks and leave the Lakewoods on? Just trying to piece this together. The right way
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The other stat I forgot to mention is Jims convetor 'flashed' to 2975 on the launch. We're heading out together in a couple of weeks...and I'm gonna video his car from the front and back to 'see' what it's doing. With 90/10's up front and stockers out back and a stock rear sway bar I'll bet it's 'tricycling' and bottoming out the rear shocks and then unloading the rear tires.
My own car has to have a perfectly prepped track...low gear 02's in the 770's...6 degrees of low gear timing added and have the convertor 'flash' to 4 grand to do a 1.5x launch. Anything less and it's 1.7x's. I'm mulling over sending Dusty a PL file of one of my runs...and have him build me a race convertor.
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If you can swing it that hr bar is what I would do. But as Jason has proven the helwig bar is a nice piece too. I like the atr because it is only $160. And as we all know I'm cheap. I'd have the blisteins as soon as I'm quick enough to score a used set. They sell fast on the big board.
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Lose the Lakewood shocks...
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Lose the Lakewood shocks...
Why? You have a bad experience with these or sum'n? Or do think this is the cause of the rears unloading?
Never mind I went back and re-read your previous post.........I'll be all right :icon_eyes: [size=78%] [/size]
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Rich, that H&R bar is sweet.......bu t sour price :icon_lol:
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Buying quality you only have to cry once. From my reading you can pretty much ditch the front bar with that h&r bar. Also you might want to look at that arm relocation kit to adjust the instant center. $90 and some wrenching then some adjusting could be the ticket.
http://www.fullthrottlespeed.com/turbo-buick-performance/buick-suspension/sway-bar-air-bag/505-mic0005.html (http://www.fullthrottlespeed.com/turbo-buick-performance/buick-suspension/sway-bar-air-bag/505-mic0005.html)
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That kit is for the lower arms which is generally not so good as it's preferable to keep the lowers close to parallel to the ground for best results. Dropping the front end of the upper arms tends to work better and does not provide as violent reaction where the back of the car rises and then unloads due to the i.c. being above the thrust line. It can also make the braking very unstable on a street car because it eliminates the anti-dive built into the car to create stable braking at speed.
Again, tho, you have to decide if you want nine second parts on a eleven second car :) If you do, go with Kevin Slaby's upper arm relocation kit that gives you much better geometry which is less likely to cause problems when used in spite of actual need.
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If you are really serious about drag racing suspension theory, buy a copy of Dave Morgan's "Door Slammers". he goes into great detail about theory and its translation to the average guy. Not cheap, but, he is not selling parts...just theory
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how much boost were you running? 112-113 is not very good for a 60 turbo, it seems to me.
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Steve,Boost was 23-24 for the most part. I did see a short spike of a pound somewhere, but about 24 psi for the most part.. Car is exactly 3800lbs with me in. Timing was 2* above Erics default setting. So 25/23*
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Your mph suggests the car is running about 12.1.
I would show Brad a PL log so he can look at third gear and also compute slippage at the line. I would expect more mph than that with that much boost. I would like to know how many rpm it gained from the shift into third to the line.
Too much squat actually means the tires are being sucked up into the body and are subject to unloading as the hp comes up after launch. It also means the hp is rotating the body when it should be pushing the car forward. I am going to stick with losing the Lakewoods :D
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Also, I told you how to check air bag pressure above...but, go to a safe place to launch the car with no cops and some nice light concrete or asphalt...laun ch the car like you would at the track and see if it leaves two equal length stripes of rubber
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Also, I told you how to check air bag pressure above...but, go to a safe place to launch the car with no cops and some nice light concrete or asphalt...laun ch the car like you would at the track and see if it leaves two equal length stripes of rubber
X2 on the making test hits. Even the street outlaws do it. and it needs to be done to get it where you want it to be.
And those strips will help you know about the tire pressure. too much in the middle needs less pressure, to strips at the edges needs more tire pressure
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K guys, pulled trigger on the Bilsteins
I'll get these on and report and improved 60' times
Steve, you have first dibs on my Lakewood 90/10's 😎
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LOL....on some cars, they probably work....but on our cars with the typical instant centers, they waste time rotating the car instead of allowing it to go forward immediately and delays the weight transfer to the tires at the same times.
You need a stiffer rear bar while you are at it. That will help reduce your reliance on the air bag
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Silly question, is there a converter still in the exhaust?
Take all the air out of the bag and pull more first gear fuel. By the time your mixture catches up to the boost, it starts to make decent power. Before that, it's too rich / can't burn what's there. That's why boost comes up/blows the tires off a few feet out.
I used to run 115 mph on a little 49 and stock cam. Stock everything in the rear. 26' D/R. 11.8's all day.
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Silly question, is there a converter still in the exhaust?
Take all the air out of the bag and pull more first gear fuel. By the time your mixture catches up to the boost, it starts to make decent power. Before that, it's too rich / can't burn what's there. That's why boost comes up/blows the tires off a few feet out.
I used to run 115 mph on a little 49 and stock cam. Stock everything in the rear. 26' D/R. 11.8's all day.
No cat, 20% fuel removed from 1st stock cam as well 180k on the clock......... .how much timing and boost we you running on the "little 49" what was your 60'? The car ran 111 back peddling outta the gate twice 2.1 60' 90* heat.
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I bet he was close to 30psi. I do think you need more boost with that alcohol.
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And here I thought I was doing a good thing adding the "cool guy" 90/10's :cool;
Ah well, sometimes the road to hell is paved with good "cool guy" intentions
We'll keep plugging away.........t his is supposed to be fun right :O
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Next up for Jim is tuning in the turn on point for the alky...which will take up an entire track session. :)
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Oh, this is fun, and lots of it. :D if it was easy we'd all be running in the 10s
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It is easy, and, we would all be running tens if we had money and common sense
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Jim, what are the compression readings on your engine?
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It is easy, and, we would all be running tens if we had money and common sense
And here I sit, short on both counts. All good though, I keep trying to learn from the info posted.
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Don't feel bad, I seem to be short of both lol
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Me three!
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Spraying alky with 24psi. Pump gas.
If I managed a 1.6 off the foot-brake, :rock: Most were 1.7-8.
Mine liked fuel in the last 1/8. I ran it at 11 ish Air/fuel ratio and it gained the most. Every car is different.
FYI, it hooked the best with the DR's with less than 20 psi in them.
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It is easy, and, we would all be running tens if we had money and common sense
And here I sit, short on both counts. All good though, I keep trying to learn from the info posted.
Me also....I read all I can and doing what I can as cheaply as I can. Mines much more of a show car than a race car. Racing is much more fun than waxing :icon_lol:
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Jim, what are the compression readings on your engine?
Steve, I have them written down in a book I have. I did this when I first purchased the car in '07 I think. I'll have a look tonight when I get home from work. 145 range seems to ring a bell but the Alzheimer's is setting in so I maybe off. I do remember all 6 were nice and close % wise.
Actually, you got me thinking, I should do a check again anyway.
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If they are all nice and even %wise, but they are 130 psi on average, the engine is tired and not giving you the opportunity to make the power it should...Far too often I get mail from guys that have the latest and greatest of everything and their car is a dog. How often have I finally found out the car has a weak cylinder, or tired valve springs, or something else basic.
It's always good to check the basic foundation before worrying about the lipstick :)
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It's always good to check the basic foundation before worrying about the lipstick
Are you speaking of personal experience Steve.
Paul Hogan comes to mind.
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Jim has fairly fresh valve springs as he sent me pix of his valve spring tool so I can try and make one for me. I on the other hand have some 980 in a box and need to be installed. Should have done it when I had the head off but it just didn't happen. I did a leakdown of all six when I did the hg. Couldn't begin to remember. I guess I need to do another.
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Yep, I put the comp 980's on the heap about around 3-4 yrs ago.
Of course I bloody well can't find my psi cylinder readings. I'm going to re-do it tomorrow so I post up some fresh numbers.
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Pretty sure I already told you to get Brad to look at a pl log. If the car does not gain but 100-200 rpm after the shift into third, you can pretty much figure a valve spring problem, or a cam/lifter problem.
Even at a relatively low boost, the car should be looking at 116-117 mph at the line-looks like two different problems to me but I am a zillion klicks away so what do I know? :D the Coriolis Effect may have changed since you guys elected Jr.
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.... since you guys elected Jr.
Don't hang that sh*t on me,,,
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Well, like they say, Rome wasn't built in a day. :) I'll get the comp #'s on the ol girl in the morning and post them up
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Ok, got some numbers finally. Sorry my compression tester seemed to have grown legs and yesterday was a holiday. So I went out and picked up a new tester this morning.
K, this was done with the motor warmed up to temp with all plugs removed and at WOT.
These are the psi readings I got wilst cranking the LC2. :)
1 - 150 2 - 145
3 - 145 4 - 145
5 - 150 6 - 150
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very good numbers!
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Thanks Steve, numbers about where they should be correct?
I had it out last night and the car was running stellar....... although nice cool air to boot.
When I had the plugs out for the compression check I could tell she was definitely running pig rich. I pulled 6% fuel from the MAF translator and that has seemed to really make a difference.
I was only out for maybe a 10 mile cruise and when I got home I thought just for curiosity sake, I'd pull that # 6 and see. Much cleaner! Maybe Rich will post a pic of before and after for me. I'm too stund to figure out how to post pic still. :) [size=78%] [/size]
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Jim ask me to post these for him. The set after the track day. A little fat looking.
(https://s25.postimg.org/fz2tnmi9n/V__3E5C.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/fz2tnmi9n/)
One after a hard pull and quick shut down . Looks pretty good to me. But I'm no expert.
(https://s25.postimg.org/72ng5y29n/V__D7A9.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/72ng5y29n/)
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150 psi is a good compression on a stock engine. Plug looks good for an alky engine.
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Rich, the 2nd pic wasn't after a hard pull just after a light cruise last night.
I'm very pleased in the way they cleaned up just with the MAF adjustment.
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Dont you usually check compression cold?
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Nope
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I did yesterday cause I didn't want to fill the garage with LC2 farts. I pulled all 6 cranked it over several times and began procedure.
Then, thought I better do it hot and to quit being such a suck. So I flamed her up and got it hot.
The difference just for shytes n giggles was appox. 10 psi from hot to cold.
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Ok, managed to get back to the track yesterday after solving my brake holding issues.
Best time prior to yesterday was 12.11 with a 1.95 60' last fall in nice cool air. Yesterday the car ran a best of 11.8 @ 113 but managed a 1.69 60' the boost was ranging from 23-26 approx on the PL file......not sure why that is.
Only changes made were some new shocks (all 4) and a fancy schmancy solid MAF pipe.
Still not the mph I'd like but beggars can't be choosers. Maybe a 28" tall tire would help, also it seems a little on the fat side as the 02's were never below 780-790ish.
Really glad to get the car into the 11's and moving in the right direction again. I've struggled this year to match the 12.11 of last year.
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Sweet.
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Nice work!
Mobile larrym
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Nice :rock:
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Thank you gents!
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Nice run! :)
Got a log of it?
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Nice run. Jim...don't go back until the air gets better. What was the 1/8th MPH and the ET? Post the log if you can. RPM at the traps?
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Well I tried to post the log, but I guess I doesn't work.
It's linked with my update post.
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Nice run. Jim...don't go back until the air gets better. What was the 1/8th MPH and the ET? Post the log if you can. RPM at the traps?
Thanks, the 1/8 mph was 92.5 et was 7.48
Trap rpm was approx 5500
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Nice run! :)
Got a log of it?
Yes Steve I do but I guess it didn't work it's in my first post of today
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You can fire it off to my e-mail if you want.
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Done!
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Convertor slip checks in at 14.75 percent. I don't know whether you can lock Davids convertor. Depending on your high gear fueling...and if it's rich...you could lean it out to make a tad more HP. If you're MPH doesn't come up...then you're likely 'blowing through' it. I'd wait for the cool/dry air to get here...toss a 28" rear tire on it...and have at it. I have 28" DR's mounted on GN rims. You're welcome to try them. I also have 10.5x28's mounted on GN rims...yours for the asking.
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May this will work. Please forgive my lack of computer skills
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No one is lacking computer skills more than I am.
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Both low and high gear can have some fuel pulled. Battery voltage is below 13...but not showing KR. October air and a 1.6x launch should garner an 11.4x. Your 02's will drop sharply.
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I think Brad nailed it. I would try the 28" tires and lock the converter if it is a good one...otherwis e, just the tires. It's a bit rich, but it will come down with better air. If you are going to run it again soon under similar conditions, then pull a little out
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I think Brad nailed it. I would try the 28" tires and lock the converter if it is a good one...otherwis e, just the tires. It's a bit rich, but it will come down with better air. If you are going to run it again soon under similar conditions, then pull a little out
Yes I agree....the 28" slic has been in the plans for awhile. Dave told me no on locking the converter. I find it difficult to believe I left at that high of boost. I'm sure I was watching the gauge and it was mid teens, but who knows the PL doesn't lie. I may of had wheel spin cause cause the 60' was nothing special. I thought it was rich too Steve. Is the link to the log working?
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Both low and high gear can have some fuel pulled. Battery voltage is below 13...but not showing KR. October air and a 1.6x launch should garner an 11.4x. Your 02's will drop sharply.
All fuel was pull from 1st (102 in the parmeter), maybe turning the gain knob back a tad on the alky would help lean things a tad. Set a Julio's recommend 6.5 and never had to touch it. Or would I be better off not touching that, and remove a tad bit of fuel overall in the chip?
I have a brand new Eastpenn top of the line battery in there.....my old Interstate was showing signs of weakness when hot cranking. Should that voltage be above 13 volts while on a full pass?
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Convertor slip checks in at 14.75 percent. I don't know whether you can lock Davids convertor. Depending on your high gear fueling...and if it's rich...you could lean it out to make a tad more HP. If you're MPH doesn't come up...then you're likely 'blowing through' it. I'd wait for the cool/dry air to get here...toss a 28" rear tire on it...and have at it. I have 28" DR's mounted on GN rims. You're welcome to try them. I also have 10.5x28's mounted on GN rims...yours for the asking.
Where are you getting this 14.75 CS from? PL analogue input values that Bob posted? If so, where are you calling the slip from? What gear and what rpm? Top of 3rd?
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Wallace Racing Calculators... just plug the data in. I'd check the voltage at the back of the alternator.
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reason I asked is i did it in the PL and the slip shows around 7% top of third gear.
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Not sure how accurate the PL CS factor is........I did the TCI one as well and it's showing 12.9%
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Wallace Racing Calculators aren't perfect...but they give a ballpark figure.
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I appreciate the offer on the slics......... ..too bad we weren't closer or if I had a run out there in the rig I'd take ya up on it.
I gotta get the 71 back down, it was supposed to go this weekend but decided to take the T instead. Couple of small things yet to work out on the GS.
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When I ran my SMC progressive alky kit, I adjusted the alky turn on point. If I don't miss my guess, these engines were designed to run about 14 PSI on pump gas. I figured adding alky before that point was drowning the engine out...but maybe I'm wrong. There's two adjustments inside the PAC controller...i f I read the directions correctly.
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I calculate 9% slip which is not bad. Calculated speed at 5491 rpm is 124.3 mph with a 26" tire. PL shows 113 mph at that rpm....113/124= 91% and 100%-91% equals 9%
sorry, 113 is the timing ticket speed...which should be more accurate than the PL speed
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Steve...can you post that formula? You're losing me on the speed at RPM with the tire size.
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This convertor I'm running must be slipping like a whore...cuz I'm seeing 5500 at the 1/8th mile...and 6000 at the 1/4 mile.
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Steve...can you post that formula? You're losing me on the speed at RPM with the tire size.
I can give you a formula if you like, but, I used this calculator http://www.advanced-ev.com/Calculators/TireSize/ (http://www.advanced-ev.com/Calculators/TireSize/)
Gives me the same answer as the Wallace Racing calculator
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6000 with a 28" tire is 146 mph
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Throw some 3.08 gears in there... what?! ;) I'd lock the converter in 3rd before changing the tires.
And if you think 790s is rich, you should see the mid-900s I am getting in the TBSS on 40% ethanol. LOL.
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I calculate 9% slip which is not bad. Calculated speed at 5491 rpm is 124.3 mph with a 26" tire. PL shows 113 mph at that rpm....113/124= 91% and 100%-91% equals 9%
sorry, 113 is the timing ticket speed...which should be more accurate than the PL speed
Thanks Steve
Any approx change/guess in trap rpm by going to a 28" tall tire? I think I'd benefit from this if my trap rpm was closer to 5k. I wouldn't expect that much buy could I expect a few hundred rpm?
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Not sure how accurate the PL CS factor is........I did the TCI one as well and it's showing 12.9%
You can adjust the slip factor. At 70MPI in 3rd gear with the converter locked it should be close to zero. If it isn't adjust the RatioHighGear parameter in PLC.ini. The number thar gets plugged in is RPM/MPH in that gear.
[ConverterSlip]
RatioLowGear=0
RatioMidGear=48
RatioHighGear=31.5
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I calculate 9% slip which is not bad. Calculated speed at 5491 rpm is 124.3 mph with a 26" tire. PL shows 113 mph at that rpm....113/124= 91% and 100%-91% equals 9%
sorry, 113 is the timing ticket speed...which should be more accurate than the PL speed
Thanks Steve
Any approx change/guess in trap rpm by going to a 28" tall tire? I think I'd benefit from this if my trap rpm was closer to 5k. I wouldn't expect that much buy could I expect a few hundred rpm?
There is about 8% difference going to a 28" tire which will put you back in the power band a bit better. It will also give you a longer foot print at launch for better/more consistent traction.
at 5000 rpm, 28" tires will give you about 6 mph more over the 26" and is about the same as going to 3.23 gears except you get more traction.
If you want the speedometer to read correctly, it takes a 27 tooth speedometer gear as opposed to the 30 tooth stock gear
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I calculate 9% slip which is not bad. Calculated speed at 5491 rpm is 124.3 mph with a 26" tire. PL shows 113 mph at that rpm....113/124= 91% and 100%-91% equals 9%
sorry, 113 is the timing ticket speed...which should be more accurate than the PL speed
Thanks Steve
Any approx change/guess in trap rpm by going to a 28" tall tire? I think I'd benefit from this if my trap rpm was closer to 5k. I wouldn't expect that much buy could I expect a few hundred rpm?
There is about 8% difference going to a 28" tire which will put you back in the power band a bit better. It will also give you a longer foot print at launch for better/more consistent traction.
at 5000 rpm, 28" tires will give you about 6 mph more over the 26" and is about the same as going to 3.23 gears except you get more traction.
If you want the speedometer to read correctly, it takes a 27 tooth speedometer gear as opposed to the 30 tooth stock gear
Wow 6 mph is more than I thought, which is great. So right now I have 27" tall MTDR's. By going up to a 28" I could expect 2-3 mph more maybe. That would put me right about where I should be at 115-116 mph I think.
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Sorry, I was using 26 for the slip...but yeah, 3mph
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12.5% like Brad stated...guess he knew they were 27's lol
Still not bad, but locking the converter around 90 mph will kick it up a bit... if the converter is a good one that can be locked.
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I've locked jobber remans at higher power levels. Do it! ;)
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I've locked jobber remans at higher power levels. Do it! ;)
Ya but what size of converter?
I'm running a 9.5"
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For once, I have no words
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I've locked jobber remans at higher power levels. Do it! ;)
Ya but what size of converter?
I'm running a 9.5"
12" stock style restall in the Monte on spray; rolled out, hit the button, and had the converter locked in 2nd and 3rd. That being said, I had a 10" TCI Super Street Fighter in my Buick at one time and locked it up too. The things you do when you are young and operating on a budget...
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For once, I have no words
Disagree with something?
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For once, I have no words
:O :)
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Steve, Wallace asks for the tire circumference for their calculation. What I did was go to MT's site and look it up for Jims tire size. I then plugged the numbers in.
Jim, don't be a fukn hero and lock that convertor just to gain a couple MPH. Your solidly in the 11's...and will get faster when the October air gets here. I had a 3400 LU convertor when I ran a 6152...and it didn't last long locked...as I always had Eric lock them for me via his chip. Consult with David before locking it.
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Steve...what RPM does the stock cam in Jims engine blow its load? 5200-5300? If that's the case...then a 28" inch tire should have the RPM's come in perfect at the traps. He might net a better short time with the 28's as well.
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A big turbo can extend to that range. We have seen cars run 10.4-10.6 with well ported heads.
As I said, taller tires provide a longer footprint and that is more important than width unless we get ridiculous. This also loads the turbo at lower rpm which gives more torque to launch with
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Steve, Wallace asks for the tire circumference for their calculation. What I did was go to MT's site and look it up for Jims tire size. I then plugged the numbers in.
Jim, don't be a fukn hero and lock that convertor just to gain a couple MPH. Your solidly in the 11's...and will get faster when the October air gets here. I had a 3400 LU convertor when I ran a 6152...and it didn't last long locked...as I always had Eric lock them for me via his chip. Consult with David before locking it.
I should have mentioned the rear tire size, sorry bout that. Yes, I'm running the MT ET street 255/60 which is approx 27" tall.
Brad, I had no desire to lock the TC for the sake of a couple of mph. The times I'm running are far from 'hero' status. I'm just glad to be going the the right direction again. I've sent Dave an email on what his thoughts were on locking it. I'm pretty sure he was not a fan of locking it. Just wanted to double check. No biggie, I'm fine with it unlocked.
Thanks for the replies guys :cheers:
[/size][size=78%] [/size]
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Wallace Racing Calculators... just plug the data in. I'd check the voltage at the back of the alternator.
Checked that just now after work. 14.58 on my digital hand held and around 14.1 on the SM. This is when first started cold.
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that is about usual, I think. I tied a voltmeter into the ecm-ign feed and get about the same voltage as the alternator..an d that feed is what powers the ecm. I think some ecms are more inaccurate that others when doing the conversion from analog to digital
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http://www.turbobuick.com/threads/displaying-torque-converter-slip-with-the-powerlogger.425906/ (http://www.turbobuick.com/threads/displaying-torque-converter-slip-with-the-powerlogger.425906/)
Enabling the power logger to give converter slip data.
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I have a pretty good idea how well a convertor is coupling with the MPH it runs. Our cars should hit about 120-121 at 11.5 with a decent convertor.
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Brad mine was always 116-118mph @ 11.5-11.6 range. That was a 9/11 locked @ 88mph
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Jeremy...you woulda run about 123 in our fall air up here. Forzfed is in Winnipeg...and he's run some silly MPH. I''ve run 11.5 at 120-121 with this AC convertor on 20 lbs without breaking a sweat in Late September thru October. There's vid of me somewhere leaving from an idle...no tune on the car...20 lbs...and going 12.2 at 117. All the heavy hitters up here wait till October to make their runs.
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Went back down to TMP yesterday..... .......lord what a mistake that was. It was bloody busy. Made 1 run. I knew there was an event going on but Jesus man.....though t I'd get 2-3 passes in minimum.
I went taking that chance, and wanted to because of the beauty cool air n good track prep.
Oh well, all in all the one pass was 12.0 with the chip in default (TT Alky)
Mind just wasn't focused with the long 3 hr wait :icon_evil: then all of the sudden were running, get ready....motor was stone cold and I'm trying to get a heat cycle through it.
Crappy burn out, left at maybe 2 psi with the boost set at 22-23 60' was close to 1.9.... yuck
Next time will be T&T ONLY.......... .if there's a next time
I was pretty disappointed loading the car up but the 12.0 in default with 22-23 ain't bad I guess with a 1.9 60'
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I remember when I used to go years back & they had the OSCA events & there were 300+ cars that all went before any T&T cars. I know what you mean when you say your heads just not into it at that point but they should still have some T&T days this year. I want to get out one of these weekends if everything works out. Been 5+ years since I've been there so it's time to get my shit together!
I could use a boost controller but if not I can probably get 23-24 lbs tuner style if I put a few more turns into the adjustable HD wastegate rod.
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Local was lamenting this may be the last year for OSCA? Dunno
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Dude... That run on defaults should give you some motivation to keep on keeping on!
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Dave...if you kept the wastegate hole to no larger than .900...you should be able to hit 28-30 PSI tuner style.
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Dude... That run on defaults should give you some motivation to keep on keeping on!
Actually very pleased with it Jason thanks. Lots of motivation left for this guy.
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Brad I didn't max the hole for the RJC pipe I left at least a solid 1/8" & I'm at 21-22 lbs with 2 turns into the rod. I need a track pass to really see where things are at because the short blips on the 401 don't cut it.
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Brad I didn't max the hole for the RJC pipe I left at least a solid 1/8" & I'm at 21-22 lbs with 2 turns into the rod. I need a track pass to really see where things are at because the short blips on the 401 don't cut it.
I turn is usually about 1 pound..at least with mine. If you turn it up a bit...toss some extra high gear fuel at it on the 1st pass. Better safe than sorry...and you can pull some on the 2nd run to bring it where you feel comfortable.
On a temp change like we've had in the last couple days...when I take it out again, I'll overfuel high gear on the 1st run...and then dial it in on the 2nd. I'm way too old to change headgaskets.
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Exactly I have No Desire to pull the motor like I used to do every winter & especially not from a track day when I have the ability to add fuel etc. Thanks for the tip! :cheers:
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Exactly I have No Desire to pull the motor like I used to do every winter & especially not from a track day when I have the ability to add fuel etc. Thanks for the tip! :cheers:
I'm gonna quit guessing on fueling next spring. I'm going 6.1. Set your AF where you want it...and go. It's easy...and I understand it...so it's the next logical step for me.
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Brad I didn't max the hole for the RJC pipe I left at least a solid 1/8" & I'm at 21-22 lbs with 2 turns into the rod. I need a track pass to really see where things are at because the short blips on the 401 don't cut it.
I hear ya on the street testing, had a good place but starting to see local sheriff's every now and then....only a matter of time before they get me on a 3rd gear test :icon_confused:
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Exactly I have No Desire to pull the motor like I used to do every winter & especially not from a track day when I have the ability to add fuel etc. Thanks for the tip! :cheers:
I'm gonna quit guessing on fueling next spring. I'm going 6.1. Set your AF where you want it...and go. It's easy...and I understand it...so it's the next logical step for me.
I'm on the fence SD2 or 6.1 .....
Mobile larrym
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Speed Density is wayyyyyyyyyyyy yyy beyond my single digit IQ.
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I went the sd2 route. Haven't installed it yet. Fortunately, there is a guy local to me that has bob Bailey helping him tune. I'm going to take it very slow after I install it. I spoke with Eric at length before pulling the trigger on it. I also had Eric make the low gear timing adjustable for my chip. His default SD2 chip doesn't have that option
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OK I'll bite, what is 6.1 something from Eric?
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OK I'll bite, what is 6.1 something from Eric?
Dave...go to Erics site and read up on it. Basically with Erics 5.7 chip you make a run on the defaults. Check your run on PL and then you guess how much fuel you add/subtract to get your desired fueling. With my car, 750 is about as far as I'm willing to push it. I've raced in all kinds of weather...so I have a good idea what to do with my fueling adjustments in regard to temp/humidity. With 6.1 you set your AF...there's no guessing. If a moron like me can understand it...then anyone can.
Eric has instructions on a PDF file on his site. You'll need a WB. I have an AFX...same as Steve has. Call Norbs...and talk to him about it if you don't have one.
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Thanks, I have a Bosch wideband and a Fancy Pants A/F gauge from Mike at FT with added little lights that also logs stuff & has interchangeabl e faces & such but I don't care to get into all that as long as I have my Powerlogger & scanmaster. I'll definitely take a look over the winter at the 6.1 because I'm like you with all the Tech, I don't have the patience to learn all of it so Simple is Good!
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Is technology really that scary?
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Mike I wouldn't say scary but not having the aid of kids it takes me much longer to teach myself. I'm not into the tech or gaming stuff as much as say the mechanical aspect of it. When I was about 11 I took apart the snowmobile engine one day to see how it worked & needless to say I couldn't put it back together. My Dad wasn't impressed! :rofl:
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Thanks, I have a Bosch wideband and a Fancy Pants A/F gauge from Mike at FT with added little lights that also logs stuff & has interchangeabl e faces & such but I don't care to get into all that as long as I have my Powerlogger & scanmaster. I'll definitely take a look over the winter at the 6.1 because I'm like you with all the Tech, I don't have the patience to learn all of it so Simple is Good!
I have a ton of patience with these cars...but I have the IQ of a house plant. I can't wrap my head around SD or any aftermarket fuel management system. 5.7 and 6.1 are easy for me to understand. I like being dumb...as it keeps me away from all the cool guy stuff.
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I suppose we are here to help guide you guys when called upon. The self tuning stuff these days makes it a breeze.
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Where was this stuff 15 years ago? I'm glad to have people like (insert name here) though and all the stuff they do for our tiny community.
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OK I'll bite, what is 6.1 something from Eric?
Dave...go to Erics site and read up on it. Basically with Erics 5.7 chip you make a run on the defaults. Check your run on PL and then you guess how much fuel you add/subtract to get your desired fueling. With my car, 750 is about as far as I'm willing to push it. I've raced in all kinds of weather...so I have a good idea what to do with my fueling adjustments in regard to temp/humidity. With 6.1 you set your AF...there's no guessing. If a moron like me can understand it...then anyone can.
Eric has instructions on a PDF file on his site. You'll need a WB. I have an AFX...same as Steve has. Call Norbs...and talk to him about it if you don't have one.
This is true. The 6.1 chip fuels based on the A/F but it has a LIMITED correction range. You have to have the base fueling with alky and all that good stuff in the window.
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How much is "LIMITED"? 7-10% a few points?
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How much is "LIMITED"? 7-10% a few points?
http://turbotweak.com/forum/index.php?threads/chip-instructions-for-the-6-0-and-6-1-wideband-chip.1136/ (http://turbotweak.com/forum/index.php?threads/chip-instructions-for-the-6-0-and-6-1-wideband-chip.1136/)
-10% to 35%. or a BLM range of 115 to 170. You can see the correction on the BLM cell or graph of the powerlogger. The closer you can get it to 128 by adjusting the base fuel the better
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Well I got "geezer" back down again this past weekend to TMP and ran a new best of 11.55
First couple of passes were off as I was feeling out the new Pro radials from MT. Found the tire pressure was about right at around 15-16 psi. Track was a bit iffy too.
The new 28" tire pulled some rpm out and put the motor in a little better power band i think.
Car is now up in the 117 mph range.
Rich (Bird) was there, was good chatting with him. Super guy! Killer GN!
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Nice run :rock:
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Nice Gus! I had mine set at 18 psi but wasn't putting enough power to the wheels at launch to see any spin. Keep up the testing and let us know how it goes!
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What size rear tire did it have before and what MPH did it run with them??
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Previous best was 11.8 and tire was MTDR 255/60's 27" tall. Mph was around 112-113 in warmer air.
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Thanks for the info....I gotta get me some 28 tall tires :icon_lol:
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Nice Gus! I had mine set at 18 psi but wasn't putting enough power to the wheels at launch to see any spin. Keep up the testing and let us know how it goes!
Thanks Jason. Car has been a blast going from the days of running high 14's when I first got it. Still haven't opened the motor, just comp 980's. Built trans in my garage.
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Are the original bushings in the rear suspension?
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Rich, UMI lowers and stock upper rear arms
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Nice :powersix: